110 replies to this topic

[rotty]

A wild Brandon appears and brings Nas and Learz out of the woodwork  lmao

Kasich over Trump any fucking day. lol

[HordeLorde]

See a guy like Kasich or Paul is someone i can kinda support when it comes to republicans....finally an opinion from someone with sense shows up in this thread.... Sheesh i was begining to think everyone is crazy

[Brandonreha]

See a guy like Kasich or Paul is someone i can kinda support when it comes to republicans....finally an opinion from someone with sense shows up in this thread.... Sheesh i was begining to think everyone is crazy

Hush little commy, let the adults talk

A wild Brandon appears and brings Nas and Learz out of the woodwork  lmao
Kasich over Trump any fucking day. lol

<3 rotty

[Lord Draculea]

Just want to say I really appreciate people having 2 jobs. Carry on, gentlemen!

[Manoka]

But anyways, while trump is stupid and all, things like government funded healthcare have been around LONG before bernie sanders. We already are giving more per capita, per citizen in the U.S., than any other country in the world. 

 

I can't think of a single one that doesn't have *some* private options, Switzerland, Norway, Finland etc. while considered vaguely "socialist", still have private systems available. Bernie Sanders wants to do away with private healthcare, so elective or cosmetic surgeries are now what, banned? You have to get it through the government, who will prioritize what is most important? I have no problem paying for life threatening conditions, but not allowing someone to take care of a less severe condition if they're willing to pay is just disgusting, and that's exactly what the system would do. There's no way around it. 

 

Either we pay for every person's boob implants and nose job, or we don't. And then it gets to the point where people's *choices* are eroded. I don't mind more government involvement, but total government involvement, only allowing that, is literally going too far down the other line. Not to mention, how is this plan going to work, are government military/police going to go stomping in to every hospital in America and say "This is U.S. property now!". I don't mind say, government ran hospitals, but taking over the current industry seems, well insane. 

Edited by Manoka, 25 January 2016 - 12:58 PM.

[King Biscuit]

CEOs make shit executives.

Don't believe me?

Case and point: Flint MI

[ᗅᗺᗷᗅ]

HordeLorde, John Kasich and Rand Paul are about as far apart on the issues as two people in the same party can be. They're almost opposites.

 

Businesspeople generally make bad political candidates and bad elected officials. That is because the goals of business and the goals of government are very different, in fact in many cases mutually exclusive. That said, I understand why the GOP establishment prefers Trump over Cruz. Trump is not really ideological, unlike Cruz, who basically wants to fly the spaceship straight into the heart of the sun. Trump is egotistical, self-aggrandizing, and crude, but the establishment can work with that, they believe.

 

Iowa will be telling. I still don't believe that Trump will be the nominee, nor that he will even complete the primary calendar. But we shall see...

[Brandonreha]

It doesn't matter if Donald doesn't get the nomination. He will still run and still win.

[HordeLorde]

HordeLorde, John Kasich and Rand Paul are about as far apart on the issues as two people in the same party can be. They're almost opposites.

 

Businesspeople generally make bad political candidates and bad elected officials. That is because the goals of business and the goals of government are very different, in fact in many cases mutually exclusive. That said, I understand why the GOP establishment prefers Trump over Cruz. Trump is not really ideological, unlike Cruz, who basically wants to fly the spaceship straight into the heart of the sun. Trump is egotistical, self-aggrandizing, and crude, but the establishment can work with that, they believe.

 

Iowa will be telling. I still don't believe that Trump will be the nominee, nor that he will even complete the primary calendar. But we shall see...

Thats why im voting Democrat....my point about Kasich and Paul was more like i could get behind any Republican Candidate other than Trump

@Brandonreha   if Trump doesnt get the nomination and still runs....he splits the republican vote and the Democrat wins....you just proved my point That Trump is an egomaniac and is doing this for himself not the people, and that youre an idiot
 

 

But anyways, while trump is stupid and all, things like government funded healthcare have been around LONG before bernie sanders. We already are giving more per capita, per citizen in the U.S., than any other country in the world. 

 

I can't think of a single one that doesn't have *some* private options, Switzerland, Norway, Finland etc. while considered vaguely "socialist", still have private systems available. Bernie Sanders wants to do away with private healthcare, so elective or cosmetic surgeries are now what, banned? You have to get it through the government, who will prioritize what is most important? I have no problem paying for life threatening conditions, but not allowing someone to take care of a less severe condition if they're willing to pay is just disgusting, and that's exactly what the system would do. There's no way around it. 

 

Either we pay for every person's boob implants and nose job, or we don't. And then it gets to the point where people's *choices* are eroded. I don't mind more government involvement, but total government involvement, only allowing that, is literally going too far down the other line. Not to mention, how is this plan going to work, are government military/police going to go stomping in to every hospital in America and say "This is U.S. property now!". I don't mind say, government ran hospitals, but taking over the current industry seems, well insane. 

while i see what youre getting at Manoka,  youre exaggerating results that havent happened yet. 

[Brandonreha]

At least I'm not a commy

[ᗅᗺᗷᗅ]

Bernie Sanders' plan does not eliminate private health care. If people can afford it and wish to do so, they would still be able to buy private insurance or go to private hospitals.

[Manoka]

while i see what youre getting at Manoka,  youre exaggerating results that havent happened yet.

 

 

The problem is that the plan inherently necessitates certain fundamental changes to our healthcare system that would invariably result in the problems presented. You can't simply have pure government control over all healthcare without the issues cropping up. How do you ensure that these institutions are government ran without taking them over by force? If your only way of getting healthcare is the government, through taxes, doesn't mean that you can't make choices on your own? Etheir taxes are raised insanely high to pay for all of it, or we prioritized only with what's important, which puts us in the same position. 

 

This is the single biggest change proposed to the U.S. perhaps ever. While socialism in broad contexts can be successful, such as in Norway, Switzerland etc. this is basically communism, where your only option is the government and they control everything. While more government power can be a good thing, absolute power rarely is. The system becomes too easy to abuse and further limits people's options in the system. It's an unavoidable problem. You can't have a system that is purely ran by the government without these problems cropping up of, what if I want to do something that the taxpayers wouldn't want to pay for? The moment it's forced on us and not given as an option is ridiculous. 

 

 

Is everyone going to have to eat certain foods or be forced to lose weight and go on diets because, the government won't pay for people's healthcare problems, or are we going to be taking care of everyone and skyrocketing the already enormously high tax rate? We have one of the highest tax rates in the world. Any more and we'd be on the verge of collapse. A 35% corporate tax rate compared to the highest in the world of 38%. [1]

 

Not to mention, how does one actually go about creating government ran health facilities? Clearly, there's already private one's in place so, what are we going to do, suddenly give all those old people the boot? All old managers or business owners in hospitals now lose it and the government takes the property? How is this even going to work? It's kind of mind boggling the logistics involved. 

Edited by Manoka, 25 January 2016 - 05:36 PM.

[HordeLorde]

i guess you dont know about congressional healthcare, healthcare for 9/11 emergency responders, S-CHIP(State Childrens Health Insurance Program), Medicaid, Medicare, WiC, the VA, and SSDI. All of which provide healthcare in one aspect or another. All of which are taxpayer funded and run by the government....which is socialism. All of which have been in place for many years before Obama was even running for congress...CONGRESS. Weve had Government run healthcare for awhile....but it wasnt available to all citizens...you had to meet certain criteria in order to recieve any of these. Now were being given the opportunity for everybody to have government run healthcare....you know equality.

Edited by HordeLorde, 25 January 2016 - 06:35 PM.

[The Dark Empire]

At least I'm not a commy

This is your only warning. Stop name calling and shit talking a fellow member.

[Brandonreha]

At least I'm not a commy

This is your only warning. Stop name calling and shit talking a fellow member.

 

Bring it, commy.

[Brandonreha]

@thedarkempire

 

I see your point stalin. Censorship is soo not a commy thing to do.

[Manoka]

i guess you dont know about congressional healthcare, healthcare for 9/11 emergency responders, S-CHIP(State Childrens Health Insurance Program), Medicaid, Medicare, WiC, the VA, and SSDI. All of which provide healthcare in one aspect or another. All of which are taxpayer funded and run by the government....which is socialism. All of which have been in place for many years before Obama was even running for congress...CONGRESS. Weve had Government run healthcare for awhile....but it wasnt available to all citizens...you had to meet certain criteria in order to recieve any of these. Now were being given the opportunity for everybody to have government run healthcare....you know equality.

I think you're missing the point entirely. The problem is not government funded healthcare, it's government only healthcare, which is what Bernie Sanders wants. Further, the disqualifying factors for government healthcare have been if you're not in poverty, not grievously injured and things like that. Universal healthcare systems are idiotic because the rich don't need as much government assistance as the poor. Giving everyone healthcare equally is stupid because some people need more healthcare than others, so we need to prioritize our resources on them. Explain to me why the rich need subsidized healthcare as much as the poor in this country do, because currently you have to be below the poverty line, grievously injured or sick, an orphan, the elderly and the like to get government money. 

 

Also, government funded healthcare is not socialism, it has nothing to do with socialism. Plenty of non-socialist governments have government funded healthcare. Seriously, not everything that's government-funded is "socialism". Or else all governments would just be socialism, then. The military and police aren't "socialism" just because it's paid for by the government, any more than healthcare. Socialism is worker-run businesses. Often times government funded healthcare is within many socialist governments, but in the same way that a tire is not a car, government funded healthcare is not socialism. 

Edited by Manoka, 25 January 2016 - 10:38 PM.

[Lord Draculea]

At least I'm not a commy

This is your only warning. Stop name calling and shit talking a fellow member.

 
Bring it, commy.

@thedarkempire
 
I see your point stalin. Censorship is soo not a commy thing to do.

Brandonreha, your continued insults to members of this AA will not be tolerated. I don't have to explain to you the difference between censorship and enforcing the terms of use of a public forum, but if you can't tell that difference, you're going to learn it the hard way. Consider yourself warned by two Gov. members already.

[Brandonreha]

Your threats ring as idle as your sex drive!

[Infopowerbroker]

First off, let me start by saying this:



Now that we have that groundwork set, I think we all can agree that the only people winning the election so far is CNN and Fox News, with the ratings circus previously known as debates.

Trump appears to have started his campaign as a publicity stunt, and can't get out (this hyperbole is presented by the "shoot someone" quote that is floating around, I honestly don't know if he said it, but it echos the sentiment).
Trump Tl;Dr; a circus campaign that is making ratings too good to pass up. He's going to supernova and implode.

After trump on the republican side, you have the same pack of candidates that you've had for the past 16 years, and nothing has really changed. The spring will shake out the pack until the contenders are left, then I'll pick a 'best candidate'

On the democrat side, the question is about who will win: the heiress, who has been appointed the nominee by the Illuminati powers that be, or the senator (futurama's professor) with an idea so crazy, it just might work! If sanders can mobilize the youth by making everything free, then he'll buy the election.

The following quote has fuzzy attribution, but I'll put it down to start a closing thought:

A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship

I'll wrap up by invoking both Washington and Eisenhower: Beware the two party system and the military industrial complex. Both cloud the process of democracy, and muddy the waters of Liberty.

Now, by all means, carry on with the ad-homonym attacks on each other. I'll check back in a month or two to see where this goes.