62 replies to this topic

[nicraM]

This is the man that flew his plane into the IRS building in Texas.

This is very important. He is not a terrorist, he is a hero and will be eventually deemed as such. I am appalled by the way the media has handled this. If you listen to his letter, you can understand that he is not crazy but a man who lost everything because of the economy and the IRS. On top of it, he seems extremely intelligent, not the crazy terrorist they have made him out to me.

There will be more, mark my words. There are all too many people that have this guys story that will follow.

We will in a time of turmoil that possibly hasn't been seen in decades, some might even say centuries.

Appreciate what you have, right now. Live for tomorrow but always live as if it's your last day.

[Waltar]

I hate videos of stuff just being read from the original letter.

Here's the original letter (for those of you who don't know how to Google):
http://www.t35.com/embeddedart.txt

[atlashill]

If he's not a terrorist, then neither is the Detroit underwear bomber, Scott Roeder, the kid who shot up Virginia Tech, or the Sea Shepherds.

The aim was to forcibly coerce a major entity & seemingly innocent people going on with their lives (or as the nutjob professor Ward Churchill infamously labelled them, "Little Eichmanns") to change their ways. Not through discourse or mutual means, but by inflicting harm on the people who just kept the machine rolling & can easily be replaced. The fatcats running the system just sit idly by and don't move a muscle with errant attacks like this.

Yes, people are getting mad as hell, and many aren't going to take it anymore. Just look at the tea parties (and I'm not referring to that unnecessarily ritzy convention two weeks ago in Nashville - if ever there was an image to contradict raising less corn & more hell, that was it!) and how career politicians are struggling against newcomers. Heck, we have an auctioneer about to become a congressman in Southwest Missouri – way to early for anyone to call it, but I anticipate him edging out both state senators vying for the open seat.

Unless it's open revolution in the ballot box, or a ridiculously huge & coordinated uprising that somehow overruns every patrol officer, state trooper, and National Guardsman on top of every aspect of a military superpower, such attacks are just going to get written off as terrorism, and achieve nothing.

[nicraM]

If he's not a terrorist, then neither is the Detroit underwear bomber, Scott Roeder, the kid who shot up Virginia Tech, or the Sea Shepherds.

The aim was to forcibly coerce a major entity & seemingly innocent people going on with their lives (or as the nutjob professor Ward Churchill infamously labelled them, "Little Eichmanns") to change their ways. Not through discourse or mutual means, but by inflicting harm on the people who just kept the machine rolling & can easily be replaced. The fatcats running the system just sit idly by and don't move a muscle with errant attacks like this.

Yes, people are getting mad as hell, and many aren't going to take it anymore. Just look at the tea parties (and I'm not referring to that unnecessarily ritzy convention two weeks ago in Nashville - if ever there was an image to contradict raising less corn & more hell, that was it!) and how career politicians are struggling against newcomers. Heck, we have an auctioneer about to become a congressman in Southwest Missouri – way to early for anyone to call it, but I anticipate him edging out both state senators vying for the open seat.

Unless it's open revolution in the ballot box, or a ridiculously huge & coordinated uprising that somehow overruns every patrol officer, state trooper, and National Guardsman on top of every aspect of a military superpower, such attacks are just going to get written off as terrorism, and achieve nothing.

The irrationality of his actions might prove to some of how irrational the taxation system truly is.

[Lucas Perry]

Also, Timothy McVeigh isn't a terrorist if this guy isn't. Which, in fact, he is. This guy just had some problems with the gov. which, I believe, was because he hadn't done taxes in a while. People find it so easy to blame others for their problems when, in fact, it's their fault and they had control over it.

The whole point of what this guy did was to sacrifice himself to fight the system, which is pointless. Especially considering the fact that there are other things he could have done. If you have a problem with this country that is that bad, just leave or suck it up, that's it.

[Sparta]

How about this statement. 911 was an inside job. Google terrorstorm and watch the video. Stay informed. Go to infowars.com to find out what the media is not telling you because there is a war on for your mind.

[King Biscuit]

All this reminds me of an old Orwellian proverb:

"If there is hope, it lies with the prols."

[nicraM]

Also, Timothy McVeigh isn't a terrorist if this guy isn't. Which, in fact, he is. This guy just had some problems with the gov. which, I believe, was because he hadn't done taxes in a while. People find it so easy to blame others for their problems when, in fact, it's their fault and they had control over it.

The whole point of what this guy did was to sacrifice himself to fight the system, which is pointless. Especially considering the fact that there are other things he could have done. If you have a problem with this country that is that bad, just leave or suck it up, that's it.

Did you listen to the letter or his story?

He wasn't working and had no money. The IRS sent him a letter a day before he was suppose to appear for a hearing to do with supposed back taxes which he neglected to pay. They never gave him a chance.

This man is no way on the same level and Tim M. and the Oklahoma City bombing.

He might be a little crazy but I have a feeling that he was a regular dude that was stripped of everything by a corrupt government.

By the way, Idk if it's in Canada or England but one of those countries a guy there got the courts to admit Council Tax is ILLEGAL and he is no longer liable.

People around the world are FED up(HAH!), not just here in the states. Let's face it, we are all in the same boat. Any country that is controlled by a Central Banking system can't be deemed truly free.

[Evil Rudekker]

While I agree that the current system of government is unjust, since when is it at all admirable to kill innocent people without warning? It doesn't matter how good of a point you want to make, killing folks who aren't fighting you is terrorism.

[nicraM]

While I agree that the current system of government is unjust, since when is it at all admirable to kill innocent people without warning? It doesn't matter how good of a point you want to make, killing folks who aren't fighting you is terrorism.

Terrorism is a term that is too loosely thrown around at this point and time.

Although I do not support the killing of innocent people, we are in many wars atm and many innocents die every day.

So arguing that point is moot. We are a country that supports terrorism. Yet bitch about it when it strikes us. Also, this wasn't a strike against the people. It was a strike for the people, in order for us to look upon and maybe ponder the error of our governments ways.

[Evil Rudekker]

If we're going to talk about how to make America more just, then we can talk up a storm. We can do this without people flying planes into buildings, and we should do it anyways. There is a lot that needs to change.

But if we're going to defend murderers, we have nothing to discuss. I do believe your justification for Joe Stack's suicide mission was exactly the same given for Mohammed Atta's suicide mission. I can find little difference between the two, except in the number of people they managed to kill.

[nicraM]

If we're going to talk about how to make America more just, then we can talk up a storm. We can do this without people flying planes into buildings, and we should do it anyways. There is a lot that needs to change.

But if we're going to defend murderers, we have nothing to discuss. I do believe your justification for Joe Stack's suicide mission was exactly the same given for Mohammed Atta's suicide mission. I can find little difference between the two, except in the number of people they managed to kill.

If you still believe that 911 wasn't false flag, we really have nothing to talk about.

[nicraM]

Also...

A member on another forum posted this, and I thought it was worth repeating.

"Stack is a rallying cry event for those who wield state power, and for those who worship it, to propagandize that the populace needs to be further cracked down on... It will be used to further pave the way for more intrusive measures for use against those who dare try to disagree with the ambitions of the state operators.

In short, the state prays for these kinds of events, it silences dissent and builds allegiance. Now the IRS will find it easier to do more, to push harder, to not pause and think that they are bulling their fellow citizens by force and threat. The state needs absolute blind allegiance from their tax collectors, this event provides the mortar to bind that allegiance."

-----------------------------

Different poster, also making a good point.

"Why is it anything someone blows some shit up in America it's automatically assumed that they were crazy? To me it seems like every time shit like this happens (9/11 included) there is a reason, and usually a good one.

Instead of attempting to resolve the core issue so that this shit doesn't happen again, they just dismiss the attackers as nutjobs and everything goes back to exactly how it was."

[King Hobbs]

Note* My ramblings are a bit random and incoherent but you get the point.

It was a terrorism attack. Plain and simple. This guy was mad at the IRS because he hadnt paid his taxes and they went after him, not even as badly as most people. It was his fault and his alone he didnt pay them. And he WAS crazy!!! Educated, but obviously off his rocker if you read the letter. Yes our government is corrupt but name a country where it isnt? He decscirbes his life as a modern day hippie (going to rallies and groups against "the Man") during college, when he was young. And he was one of those that kept his ideas when he grew up. OF COURSE HE WAS CRAZY! It sounds like even his father was too(also a man who, using simple math, we can infer was in his 20s in the 60s if his child was about 19 in the 80s)!

He wasn't working and had no money. The IRS sent him a letter a day before he was suppose to appear for a hearing to do with supposed back taxes which he neglected to pay. They never gave him a chance.

No he wasnt working. He had tried to start two businesses, 1 in California and 1 here in Texas. . Both failed. When he neglected to pay his taxes in California he fled to Texas. The same thing happened here. Thats a risk you take when you start your own business, especially trying to compete with big businesses. Hence people are able to file for bankruptcy, and if you do it right, keep your house and belongings, and reduce your debt. Im sure the IRS sent him MANY letters . And what Hearing do you speak of? Once again you are misinformed. It wasnt just BACK taxes he didnt pay, he didnt pay his taxes to begin with. You also called him a hero? When do heroes fly planes into buildings full of civilians? I would recommend you be thrown out of the alliance for that because it obviously shows you are not quite right mentally(yes i just called YOU crazy). Anyone who supports this mans actions in any form is either not a good person, or is not mentally stable. He killed and injured people he didnt even know and did nothing to him, deserved or not. Thats terrorism and murder. No, war isnt that different, but its a different subject entirely! The War in Iraq is, essentially, a defensive action. While we went in for the wrong reasons, we have stayed for the right. If we dont hunt down the remaining terrorist in Iraq, and train the new Iraqi armed forces, the bad guys would just come back into power and raise hell. And if we dont keep an eye on the new government, it will start to raise hell. So stop comparing the two. Everyone has to pays their taxes, the way taxes are done is pretty messed up, but you still have to pay them. You cant bitch that the government wants the money you didnt pay them.


And you conspiracy theorists, i have met people in the FBI, been in several of their offices, met people from the CIA, and the IRS. None are smart enough to pull off these conspiracies. I promise. They would not be labeled "conspiracies" if they tried the nonsense ya'll speak of. They would be called "facts" by the evening news. I guarantee 9/11 was by the crazy people the government said did it, and ADMITTED they did it.

People who work at the IRS at mean. The man killed, was a 70+ year old career tax collector. A MEAN sonovabitch. Does that mean he deserves to die because he was unfriendly in a less than desired job?

What about the burn victim that was hospitalized? I watched him cry when my mother was able to find his St. Christopher's medallion for him and gave it back to him.

In conclusion: This man was an old hippy, crazy, and a terrorist. He didnt pay his taxes. The IRS went after him(as they always do). He decided it was unfair the government wanted the money he owed them and decided to hurt civilians. A misinformed NicraM called this man a hero.

IDC how corrupt the gov is or you think it is, you still have to pay taxes(his were about $1100 that he didnt pay in California). And flying a plane into a building is terrorism and murder.

[nicraM]

Wow.. I don't even really know how to respond to that.

First off, how dare you call for me being kicked out of the alliance cause of my opinion?

You are mad and bewildered cause your mom was there. That is your tie to this situation. You need to learn to separate yourself if you are gonna have a conversation.

Now, onto the issue.

This guy was being harassed by the government to pay taxes on something that failed. It failed, let it go! But no! The IRS needs their cut from nothing. Now he has nothing. Even less than nothing.

I hope you have to experience that one day in your life.

Also, to think a man that articulated a letter such as that. Albeit nothing extraordinary but overall decently put together. You begin to realize that maybe there was more to this story.

I am not a conspiracy theorists. At all. I look at things logically.

I also think for myself and question authority.

That is what you have apparently lost...

After that.. I stopped reading when you started talking about terrorists and bad guys.

I bet you still think the zionists are correct in their displacement of the palenstinians.

Or

That Georgia was in the right for committing genocide in several villages during the summer olympics.

Which we supported.

[Daniel P]

@nicraM would you be mad if someone you love almost got killed.

[nicraM]

@nicraM would you be mad if someone you love almost got killed.

Even though that is not the true issue at hand. I will answer that with, yes. Yes I would be.

But I would also not post in someones thread with such an obvious one sided point of view.

I made mention of it, cause it is clear what is driving his response(s).

[Daniel P]

@nicraM would you be mad if someone you love almost got killed.

Even though that is not the true issue at hand. I will answer that with, yes. Yes I would be.

But I would also not post in someones thread with such an obvious one sided point of view.

I made mention of it, cause it is clear what is driving his response(s).

Well reading your posts you doing the same one sided posts too.

[nicraM]

@nicraM would you be mad if someone you love almost got killed.

Even though that is not the true issue at hand. I will answer that with, yes. Yes I would be.

But I would also not post in someones thread with such an obvious one sided point of view.

I made mention of it, cause it is clear what is driving his response(s).

Well reading your posts you doing the same one sided posts too.

For the sake of this not turning into a flame war.

I will bow out of this conversation.

But before I leave, I have to say this.

The only reason most feel this is an attack on them is cause of what the media is telling them. This is surely not an attack on the people of America. It is an attack on the establishment.

To condone certain actions abroad while deeming others that are done to us, as terror is asinine.

Furthermore, to put this guy with the likes of Tim M. or the 911 bombers is rather misguided.

[Shotgun Willy]

au contraire

What he did is almost the book definition of "Terrorism"

Causing terror to get what he wants.