Jump to content


Photo

Time Lord or Jedi?


  • Please log in to reply
58 replies to this topic

Poll: Time Lord or Jedi? (20 member(s) have cast votes)

Would you rather be a Time Lord or a Jedi?

  1. Time Lord (7 votes [35.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 35.00%

  2. Jedi (13 votes [65.00%])

    Percentage of vote: 65.00%

Vote Guests cannot vote

#21 Redezra

Redezra

    ~>:BAMF:<~

  • Invicta: Knight
  • 7728 posts
  • Gender:Sentient artificial intelligence - identifies as female
  • Location::D
  • Ruler Name:Redezra
  • Nation Name:Jorostopia
  • IRC Nick:Redezra
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link


Posted 12 February 2014 - 02:41 AM

Most of the books were in that period, it's all multimedia and games now...

 

Still, give this a try http://starwars.wiki...e_Old_Republic_(novel_series)



#22 the rebel

the rebel
  • Former Member
  • 1961 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Manchester UK
  • Ruler Name:the rebel
  • Nation Name:rebellion
  • IRC Nick:TheRebel
  • Nation Link

Posted 12 February 2014 - 01:06 PM

Have to be a Timelord...possibilities are endless.



Member Awards ()

#23 ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

    The Invictan Formerly Known as Jorost

  • Lord Protector
  • 16192 posts
  • Gender:Household pet that walked across the keyboard - male
  • Location:Massachusetts
  • Ruler Name:Jorost
  • Nation Name:Invicta Crownlands
  • IRC Nick:Jorost
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link






Posted 12 February 2014 - 03:35 PM

Too bad the canonicity of all that EU stuff is no longer assured.  Like I've always said, if it didn't happen onscreen it didn't happen.

Dwight-Schrute-False.jpg
 
Only things that happened after ROTJ are getting cut. This is part of Star Wars: The Old Republic, which is grade A+, totally freaking happened, canon.

 

For now.  Don't count on it staying that way.

 

Like I said, if it didn't happen onscreen, it didn't happen.  :)

 

I read the Darth Bane books, or at least the first two of them.  I liked them.  But they didn't feel like Star Wars to me.



Member Awards ()

#24 Redezra

Redezra

    ~>:BAMF:<~

  • Invicta: Knight
  • 7728 posts
  • Gender:Sentient artificial intelligence - identifies as female
  • Location::D
  • Ruler Name:Redezra
  • Nation Name:Jorostopia
  • IRC Nick:Redezra
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link


Posted 12 February 2014 - 06:41 PM

For now.  Don't count on it staying that way.

 

Like I said, if it didn't happen onscreen, it didn't happen.   :)

Dwight-Schrute-False.jpg
 

Jorost, you're a casual star wars fan, not a diehard star wars fan. I'm not at the "I don't give a shit what Disney says, clearly they are non canon" level, but I know enough to know that TOR happened.

 

I agree, Bane's a piece of crap, but if it's in the Book of Sith, it happened.



#25 ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

    The Invictan Formerly Known as Jorost

  • Lord Protector
  • 16192 posts
  • Gender:Household pet that walked across the keyboard - male
  • Location:Massachusetts
  • Ruler Name:Jorost
  • Nation Name:Invicta Crownlands
  • IRC Nick:Jorost
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link






Posted 12 February 2014 - 07:02 PM

Lol.  Redezra, I have been a diehard Star Wars fan since before you were born.  It's just that, like a lot of people, the EU simply does not interest me.  Which is not to say that it's bad — some of it is, some of it isn't.  But the idea that it is part of some "official" storyline is ridiculous.  Time and time again, onscreen events, characters, and dialog have refuted previously "canonical" material.  Coruscant used to "officially" be called Corellia, for example.  My point is simply this:  Do not make the mistake of assuming that some aspect of the EU that you love is necessarily going to remain part of the "official" canon.  In fact, stop worrying about canon altogether and just enjoy stuff for what it is.  It's a lot less stressful!

As for the EU, my problem with it is that it kills too much of the magic for me.  I liked Star Wars better when the Jedi were some mysterious, mythical thing.  You didn't know the details, so you were free to imagine anything you wanted.  Filling in those details makes the whole saga seem so much... smaller.  It's similar to how I feel about Episodes I-III.



Member Awards ()

#26 Redezra

Redezra

    ~>:BAMF:<~

  • Invicta: Knight
  • 7728 posts
  • Gender:Sentient artificial intelligence - identifies as female
  • Location::D
  • Ruler Name:Redezra
  • Nation Name:Jorostopia
  • IRC Nick:Redezra
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link


Posted 12 February 2014 - 07:40 PM

But you can't lump all the EU stuff into one bucket! That's where I can't deal Jorost :P 

 

There are 5 levels of Star Wars Canon. G, T, C, S, and N

 

G (for George) is the movies, and anything said by George Lucas. Note these are the current films, the older films drop to S canon. This one is one of the three "prime" canon levels, meaning they are what Lucasfilm considers "true", the hierarchy of these three is specifically to define which can overrule the others, and in which order, if a conflict occurs. It is because Episode 7 is G canon, and the EU is (mostly) C canon that all the post ROTJ EU stuff is getting overruled. THIS DOES NOT MEAN THAT OTHER C STUFF DID NOT HAPPEN AT THIS TIME :P.

T (for TV) is the tv canon zone, and that means the current tv series'. This overrules a whole bunch of clone war books, and comics, and the old clone wars series.

C (for Continuity) is the "other media" currently valid canon zone. This consists of most of the Star Wars books, anything produced by Lucasarts or their affiliates, and any comics. Notably, these are all the things that have not been overruled by the two layers above. This is where the Old Sith Empire lives. It's also where the name "Coruscant" used to live, until it's inclusion in Episode 1 jumped it to G canon.

 

S (for Secondary) is the "Used to be canon but got overruled" zone. This stuff isn't canon anymore, but was at one time. This is where Han shooting first lives, and now where most of Phate's favourite Star Wars books live.

N (for Non) is the "Lol this wasn't part of canon in the first place" zone. Fanfics, the Infinities multiple universe stuff, and the like live here.

 

 

Right, so, now maybe you get what I've been trying to say. I don't like it when order is not followed, and Star Wars has a very particular order. I don't break with prime canon because "screw them I liked this idea", I actually change my idea of what happened in the Star Wars universe based on what stays and goes. If the new series discounted the old sith empire, I'd be fine with that. But it has not happened, which means it's still valid. So please, don't tell me you know what is and is not canon. :3



#27 King Biscuit

King Biscuit

    Wanna see a dead body?

  • President Emeritus
  • 6393 posts
  • Gender:Conjoined Twin, Male
  • Location:3rd world country formerly known as Michigan
  • Ruler Name:King Biscuit
  • Nation Name:Ovencia
  • IRC Nick:KingBeard
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link




Posted 13 February 2014 - 04:34 AM

Han always shot first.

The fact that Lucas changed it still irks me to this day.



Member Awards ()

#28 ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

    The Invictan Formerly Known as Jorost

  • Lord Protector
  • 16192 posts
  • Gender:Household pet that walked across the keyboard - male
  • Location:Massachusetts
  • Ruler Name:Jorost
  • Nation Name:Invicta Crownlands
  • IRC Nick:Jorost
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link






Posted 13 February 2014 - 09:01 AM

I doubt the new trilogy will mention any of the EU stuff that takes place in the distant past.  But it's not inconceivable that you could see a new TV series that disputes something previously established as canon.  My biggest problem is that all this detail, and even the "multiple layers" of canonicity, smacks too much of Star Trek.  Like I said, I liked the magic and mystery.

 

I imagine the arrival of the new, Disney-produced films will create a schism in the Star Wars community, in which some people refuse to recognize the canonicity/validity/whatever of one side or the other.  Which side I fall on will depend heavily on how the new movies turn out.  There are good people working on them, people who seem to respect the source material, so I'm optimistic.



Member Awards ()

#29 King Biscuit

King Biscuit

    Wanna see a dead body?

  • President Emeritus
  • 6393 posts
  • Gender:Conjoined Twin, Male
  • Location:3rd world country formerly known as Michigan
  • Ruler Name:King Biscuit
  • Nation Name:Ovencia
  • IRC Nick:KingBeard
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link




Posted 13 February 2014 - 09:54 AM

I have my fingers crossed for Mara Jade and the Jedi Twins.



Member Awards ()

#30 ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

    The Invictan Formerly Known as Jorost

  • Lord Protector
  • 16192 posts
  • Gender:Household pet that walked across the keyboard - male
  • Location:Massachusetts
  • Ruler Name:Jorost
  • Nation Name:Invicta Crownlands
  • IRC Nick:Jorost
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link






Posted 13 February 2014 - 03:47 PM

I want to see grumpy old Han Solo chafing at the protocol of being married to the President of the Republic, or whatever Leia is called.



Member Awards ()

#31 the rebel

the rebel
  • Former Member
  • 1961 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Manchester UK
  • Ruler Name:the rebel
  • Nation Name:rebellion
  • IRC Nick:TheRebel
  • Nation Link

Posted 13 February 2014 - 04:39 PM

If you want to be anal, then only what George Lucas writes happens in the Star wars universe. After all its his universe and his story.



Member Awards ()

#32 ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

    The Invictan Formerly Known as Jorost

  • Lord Protector
  • 16192 posts
  • Gender:Household pet that walked across the keyboard - male
  • Location:Massachusetts
  • Ruler Name:Jorost
  • Nation Name:Invicta Crownlands
  • IRC Nick:Jorost
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link






Posted 13 February 2014 - 07:54 PM

I would say that anything he says happened, happened.  The problem is that he has changed what he said happened.  And of course now he has turned over stewardship to someone else, so now what's cannon?  What if there comes a day when what Lucas says is at odds with what Disney says?  All kinds of interesting possibilities abound!  We could be looking at the Internet's first full-scale civil war.  :)



Member Awards ()

#33 Redezra

Redezra

    ~>:BAMF:<~

  • Invicta: Knight
  • 7728 posts
  • Gender:Sentient artificial intelligence - identifies as female
  • Location::D
  • Ruler Name:Redezra
  • Nation Name:Jorostopia
  • IRC Nick:Redezra
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link


Posted 13 February 2014 - 09:11 PM

Disney owns Lucasfilm, therefore what disney says goes.

 

What I find grating about your attitude to this, Jorost, is that you act as if all this other stuff is fanfic crap. It's not, it's commissioned by the Lucas family of companies. Lucas doesn't own the story, his companies... well... used to be his... do. And they commission books, tv series, comics, games, all sorts of stuff. This isn't "How the fans order canon", this is "How lucasfilm and co keep their story straight". They have a freaking canon curator position! Like, a whole job, just to make sure they don't get confused about their own story:P

 

It's not some illegitimate bullshit crap that basement dwelling fan-ogres obsess over. C canon is as solid as G canon. It's as if it was in a movie. And before you say movie things are more solid, let me post this at you:

 

han-shot-first.jpg



#34 the rebel

the rebel
  • Former Member
  • 1961 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Manchester UK
  • Ruler Name:the rebel
  • Nation Name:rebellion
  • IRC Nick:TheRebel
  • Nation Link

Posted 14 February 2014 - 08:56 AM

I would say that anything he says happened, happened.  The problem is that he has changed what he said happened.  And of course now he has turned over stewardship to someone else, so now what's cannon?  What if there comes a day when what Lucas says is at odds with what Disney says?  All kinds of interesting possibilities abound!  We could be looking at the Internet's first full-scale civil war.  :)

 

...and who wants to bet they will kill the series? 6 films is enough.



Member Awards ()

#35 ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

    The Invictan Formerly Known as Jorost

  • Lord Protector
  • 16192 posts
  • Gender:Household pet that walked across the keyboard - male
  • Location:Massachusetts
  • Ruler Name:Jorost
  • Nation Name:Invicta Crownlands
  • IRC Nick:Jorost
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link






Posted 14 February 2014 - 11:40 AM

Yeah, I really don't want to get into a big back and forth about what is canon and what is not.  Bottom line:  It doesn't matter what anyone — Lucas himself, the company, anyone — says, nothing is guaranteed until and unless it appears onscreen.  Too many times in the past this or that point of the SW universe was considered canon, only to have onscreen events change it.  Partly that's because it was (and is) a work in progress.  Things change.  Partly it's because Lucas designed it that way, and that's fine.  But I am merely warning you as a friend:  Don't get too wrapped up in what is canon, and don't assume that some aspect of the story you love will necessarily remain canonical.  I've been burned on that too many times.

 

If I created a fantasy universe, I would probably do much the same thing that Lucas has done, to wit:  Reserve certain characters and events to me and me alone, and open up the rest to others.  Some things I would designate as canon, and they would become part of the "main" storyline.  Other things I would not, but that doesn't mean people could not still enjoy them.  But then I have the advantage of living in a world where the concept of "canon" is well-established.  That was not so in the 1970s and 1980s when Star wars was coming up.  Hell, somewhere in a box I have a SW novel from (iirc) the very late '70s, officially licensed by Lucasfilm, etc., that blatantly contradicts much of what came later.  It was "canon" once (although I don't think that term existed yet in its present form), later it was not.

 

The bigger and more complex a world becomes, the more writers who have their hands in the pot, the harder it becomes to maintain continuity.  Marvel and DC have both run into this problem several times, and have addressed it with varying degrees of success.  If the Star Wars franchise continues and grows, they may have to face it at some point.  Or maybe not.  Who knows?  It doesn't mean you can't enjoy the stories for what they are.

 

As for the EU, I just don't enjoy most of what I've seen.  I don't hate it, please don't misunderstand me.  And some of it (i.e. the Bane books) has even been pretty good.  But, for me anyway, none of it feels like Star Wars.  It just feels like (in most cases) reasonably well-crafted, more or less generic science fiction.

 

(Note:  I do hate the Timothy Zahn books, though.  I think they fail in terms of character, storyline, and capturing the feel of the SW universe.)

 

Star Wars has become almost like a religion, and it's at that stage of development in which schisms and variant orthodoxies begin to emerge.  To continue with the analogy, I suppose I'd be a strict fundamentalist, in that I really only recognize the sanctity of the "Old Testament," i.e. Episodes IV-VI.  Episodes I-III are the "New Testament," and the EU is the Apocrypha.

 

Hmm.  This all fits rather well.  Maybe we should consider creating a Star wars religion...



Member Awards ()

#36 ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

    The Invictan Formerly Known as Jorost

  • Lord Protector
  • 16192 posts
  • Gender:Household pet that walked across the keyboard - male
  • Location:Massachusetts
  • Ruler Name:Jorost
  • Nation Name:Invicta Crownlands
  • IRC Nick:Jorost
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link






Posted 14 February 2014 - 11:45 AM

...and who wants to bet they will kill the series? 6 films is enough.

 

I'm really not worried about that.  In fact, I think they (meaning Disney) will do a better job than Lucas.  Consider:  Lucas was the creator, therefore he had no obligation to anyone but himself.  It was his world, he could do what he wanted.  Disney does not have that advantage.  They are not the creators, merely the stewards.  They have to be a lot more careful about what they put out there, because there is a whole fan universe waiting to judge them (and that judgment could carry a harsh financial penalty if it is negative enough).  The people they have hired to shepherd these projects have all demonstrated a love, even reverence, of the source material that only true fans can appreciate.  I look forward to seeing what they produce.

 

TL;DR:  Bottom line, they can't do worse than Lucas did with Episodes I-III.  :)



Member Awards ()

#37 Redezra

Redezra

    ~>:BAMF:<~

  • Invicta: Knight
  • 7728 posts
  • Gender:Sentient artificial intelligence - identifies as female
  • Location::D
  • Ruler Name:Redezra
  • Nation Name:Jorostopia
  • IRC Nick:Redezra
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link


Posted 15 February 2014 - 08:18 AM

Oh I get it, and what I'm doing is essentially getting upset that you refuse to acknowledge the existance of Lillith.



#38 Imperator

Imperator
  • Foreign Diplomat
  • 421 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Perth, Australia
  • Ruler Name:Imperator Honorius
  • Nation Name:Ishtaristan
  • IRC Nick:Imperator
  • Alliance Name:Green Protection Agency
  • Nation Link

Posted 16 February 2014 - 01:48 AM

Well, if we're opening it up to anything and everything I'd be a Q.   :D

 

TNGHideQ0.jpg

This :P



#39 Redezra

Redezra

    ~>:BAMF:<~

  • Invicta: Knight
  • 7728 posts
  • Gender:Sentient artificial intelligence - identifies as female
  • Location::D
  • Ruler Name:Redezra
  • Nation Name:Jorostopia
  • IRC Nick:Redezra
  • Alliance Name:Invicta
  • Nation Link


Posted 17 February 2014 - 07:09 PM

Pfft. Q. W/e

 

 

Have you read the Star Wars/Star Trek fanfic where it turns out that Star Wars is seeded by Star Trek due to time travel shenanigans and that Q is the child of Picard and that's why he spends so much time around him?

 

That was one of the best written worst stories I've ever read.



#40 Haflinger

Haflinger

    Flipper

  • Foreign Diplomat
  • 10259 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Ruler Name:Haflinger
  • Nation Name:Llonach
  • IRC Nick:Haflinger
  • Nation Link

Posted 19 February 2014 - 06:49 AM

My vote may surprise you, as most people are aware that I like Doctor Who a lot and think Star Wars is OK.

 

Jedi get lightsabers. Has to be them.



Member Awards ()


0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users