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#1 Justavictim82

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Posted 28 October 2014 - 01:19 AM

Constitution: It is fine the way it is with the exception of the following:
 
1) Remove the Electoral College and install a popular majority. Every other Democracy in 
the world does this and is fine.
2) Restructure campaign finance. 
      a) Anyone can contribute any amount of money to campaign funds but they need to 
disclose how much. 
      b) Only American citizens can make campaign contributions
      c) Contributions are put in a group kitty and are equally distributed to delegates 
for each level of government (all mayors candidates get x, all governors get y, all 
congress races get z)
 
 
Conservatives:
 
1) (Evangelicals) You cannot be pro-life and support the death penalty
2) The 1st Amendment is just as important as the 2nd, especially Separation of Church and 
State
3) Show me one piece of legislation that Barack Obama has sponsored or written that states 
he wants to take your guns.
4) The United States is not a Christian country
5) Liberals are not coming to take all your money away
6) Stop listening to Rush, O'Reilly or Fox News, they do not care about you they only want 
your money.
7) Some regulation/oversight is needed. Asking business and only said business to do the 
right thing when their only objective is make as much money as possible is a recipe for 
disaster. See Wall Street.
8) The Federal government is a necessity. 
9) The Fed is a necessity. Without it the last financial crisis would have brought the 
second Great Depression. It needs to be overhauled not eliminated
10) Admit when you are wrong. Liberals do it (sometimes too often). You are not smarter 
than the room.
11) Stop letting the Tea Party be the voice of reason in your party. They are an 
overwhelming minority and should be treated as such.
12) Stop letting Evangelicals be the voice of your party.. see 11
13) Stop governing by fear.
14) (Evangelicals) The Earth is older than 6000 years and humans never rode dinosaurs. 
15) Trickle Down Economics do not work. Stop trying economic policies that are worthless.
16) Stop alienating minorities. Very soon White Males will be the minority. You need women 
and Hispanics/Blacks to win elections. 
17) Can you get Alex Jones to shut the fuck up already? Everything is not a false flag. 
18) The defense budget needs to be cut. We do not need to outspend the next 10 countries 
combined. Even if we cut all spending whatsoever, it would still take China (who is the 
closest) almost 3 decades to catch up. 
 
19) The world hasn't moved left, you have moved right. A generation (hell close to 2 now) ago a man by the name of Barry Goldwater was your savior. In 2014, his policies would be considered pinko leftist. Hell even Nixon and his EPA, opening talks with China, and going soft on the USSR would be considered liberal.
 
 
Liberals:
1) Stop acting like you are smarter than the room. The average American is uninformed and 
does not relate to you let alone understand you.
2) (Ultra-liberals) The 2nd Amendment is just as important as 1st, You will never repeal it 
so stop trying. 
3) The Death Penalty is a necessary evil. Some people cannot be allowed to live in society 
and it costs entirely too much to incarcerate them. 
4) We do not need to regulate the fuck out of everything. Some things are common sense and 
some things need to be dictated by the market to drive cost down. 
5) Find a better voice for your party when it comes to equal rights. Jesse Jackson and Al 
Sharpton have transformed into attention seeking Charlestons that do not like to get their 
hands dirty. Promote Cornel West.
6) Stop compromising. Your opponents don't
7) Pick a stance and stick to it. 
8) Do not be ashamed to stand up for the arts. 
9) Nominate Neil DeGrasse Tyson for president in 2016. Even if he declines, do it anyway.
10) Grow a backbone. 
11) (Ultra-Liberals) Pacifism does not work. Giving peace a chance will wind up with us 
being invaded and conquered. 
12) Realize that organized labor is dying and while it still has a place, its role needs to 
be diminished. 
13) Taxes do not need to be raised. Ever. There are plenty of ways to balance the budget 
without taking more money from the lower and middle class. 
14) Find a spokes(wo)man that represents core Liberal values and latch onto them.
 
15) Stop feeling guilt about what happened 10 years ago or longer. Odds are you had nothing to do with it and if your great-great-great grandfather was a slave owner doesn't mean that you hate blacks, it means you had an asshole relative. Just like everyone else. 
16) Stop naming your kids after trends. Neveah is going to hate you at 18 for her name in between stints on the pole and Jagerbombs.
17) The world doesn't need saved. Worry about your own lives and cause before adopting others. If someone asks you for help, help them. If not, butt out.
 
 
All:
 
1) Corporations are not people. They need to pay taxes just like everyone else.
2) Close the corporate tax loopholes. I know easier said that done. 
3) Citizens United is unconstitutional. 
4) Foreign aid needs to be slashed immensely. Stop giving aid to countries that do not like 
us and stop propping up regimes for the sake of having an ally in the region (Israel)
5) It is time for the United States and the rest of the world to realize that Zionist 
Israel is a threat to global security.
6) Islam is no more a violent religion than Judaism or Christianity. They are currently 
going through the same growing pains as Christianity at this age in their history.
7) We need to come up with alternative solutions to fossil fuels and we needed them 
yesterday.
8) Create a 3rd party that means something. Whether it be a more liberal party than the democrats or a middle of the road party... 2 major parties do not represent the ideology of every American. 
 
9) Nothing in politics or the life of the average American is black and white.
10) "Here is how you make your Liberal/Conservative friend/relative/neighbor/coworker lose his shit" grandstanding posts on social media are idiotic.
11) Dressing your pet cat or dog in clothing outside of maybe a Halloween costume, so long as it appropriate and isn't cruel, should be grounds for mental health evaluation
12) Comparing a current political figure(s) to Hitler/Nazis is baseless and stupid. 
13) Public utilities are a necessity. I would like to think that having competing utility companies would drive down costs but I also realize that to have true competition, these companies would require infrastructure that would need to built from the ground up and in some cases, like electric companies, is not fiscally responsible or obtainable.  
14) Euthanasia/the Right to Die should be legalized. We do it with animals so why shouldn't humans with terminal illness be allowed to choose to end their own life?
 
 
Reserving for edit later 
 
Edit 1: Formatting and spellcheck




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#2 KiWi

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Posted 28 October 2014 - 01:44 AM

eh.

1) Remove the Electoral College and install a popular majority. Every other Democracy in
the world does this and is fine.


Close enough.

1) Corporations are not people.

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#3 Manoka

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Posted 28 October 2014 - 10:48 AM

This shit gets to stay but my chainsaw thread gets moved?

 

This is some bullshit. 



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#4 Justavictim82

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Posted 28 October 2014 - 11:08 AM

Because my topic actually has to do with Politics? 

 

TheMoreYouKnowLogo.jpg



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#5 Manoka

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Posted 28 October 2014 - 01:05 PM

Because my topic actually has to do with Politics? 

 

TheMoreYouKnowLogo.jpg

You just don't get it, do you?!

 

Well, the thing is... the thing... is... 

 

 

Um... 

 

O.o?

 

 

EXACTLY!

 

So hah!



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#6 King Biscuit

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Posted 28 October 2014 - 04:09 PM

9) Nominate Neil DeGrasse Tyson for president in 2016. Even if he declines, do it anyway.

 

10,000x yes.

 

 

Because my topic actually has to do with Politics? 

 

TheMoreYouKnowLogo.jpg

You just don't get it, do you?!

 

Well, the thing is... the thing... is... 

 

 

Um... 

 

O.o?

 

 

EXACTLY!

 

So hah!

 

pOl3ICQ.jpg



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#7 Justavictim82

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Posted 28 October 2014 - 05:52 PM

eh.

1) Remove the Electoral College and install a popular majority. Every other Democracy in
the world does this and is fine.


Close enough.

1) Corporations are not people.


Overall popular vote is the only real way to draw back disenfranchised voters. If I am a Liberal in Nebraska, why does it matter if I vote because my vote isn't going to mean shit in the general election. Same with a conservative in New England.

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#8 Manoka

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Posted 28 October 2014 - 08:34 PM

Popular vote just seems rather impractical. 

 

Also Israel is awesome, what is with all the Israel hate. 



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#9 KiWi

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Posted 28 October 2014 - 09:51 PM


eh.

1) Remove the Electoral College and install a popular majority. Every other Democracy in
the world does this and is fine.


Close enough.

1) Corporations are not people.

Overall popular vote is the only real way to draw back disenfranchised voters. If I am a Liberal in Nebraska, why does it matter if I vote because my vote isn't going to mean shit in the general election. Same with a conservative in New England.
 


I agree, but I also disagree, and I'm also scared of change.

If we went to a popular vote, you could easily focus government projects in California, Texas, New York, and Florida (and no longer for electoral votes, but for popular) and do your job un-proportionally.

How do we solve the problem? I don't know. I think we have a major problem with the balance and distribution of power from the lowest forms, to the highest (speaking of Congress), and if I may, I think we should expand the conversation to discuss that first.

America is a vast nation, in terms of population diversity, shear numbers, economical, social, political, physical, resources. America is fucking huge. With a lot of people. I am not okay with parts of the country turning into slums (...) while other cities shine with false polish.

How do we not have just, awfulness in NJ for example, while dumping all the money in the world into New York? Then again, New York produces more tax dollars than it consumes (to my knowledge). So that's a stupid question. But what if populations shift again? We need to take care of our forests. Our plains. The watershed that allows us to feed ourselves, and if allowed to be ruined (it's being ruined) will hurt our nation in centuries, millennia to come. (Que being dramatic, but I am being serious about this, if using hyperbole).

I'm sorry I'm shitting in your thread.




um. I believe the electoral college was 1) put in place to try and balance the powers of different parts of the country, 2) often goes with popular vote anyway, 3) while imperfect, I believe many of the actual problems are with our 2 party system or our very vastly sprawled (and changing) population. 4) If we could just *make it happen* I guess I could be okay with it (I'd like to do more thinking and reading on it. I like to be sure of things I decide), but I think there are more important issues first (not that you didn't list many things, many that I do like, (I even kinda like the first one), but putting the electoral college as your #1 was off putting to me.

Sorry for more shitty.




tl;dr
What do you think you know better than our Forefathers? Why don't you start your own country you redcoat.

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#10 Justavictim82

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Posted 28 October 2014 - 10:20 PM

 

eh.

1) Remove the Electoral College and install a popular majority. Every other Democracy in
the world does this and is fine.


Close enough.

1) Corporations are not people.

Overall popular vote is the only real way to draw back disenfranchised voters. If I am a Liberal in Nebraska, why does it matter if I vote because my vote isn't going to mean shit in the general election. Same with a conservative in New England.
 

 

I agree, but I also disagree, and I'm also scared of change.

If we went to a popular vote, you could easily focus government projects in California, Texas, New York, and Florida (and no longer for electoral votes, but for popular) and do your job un-proportionally.

How do we solve the problem? I don't know. I think we have a major problem with the balance and distribution of power from the lowest forms, to the highest (speaking of Congress), and if I may, I think we should expand the conversation to discuss that first.

America is a vast nation, in terms of population diversity, shear numbers, economical, social, political, physical, resources. America is fucking huge. With a lot of people. I am not okay with parts of the country turning into slums (...) while other cities shine with false polish.

How do we not have just, awfulness in NJ for example, while dumping all the money in the world into New York? Then again, New York produces more tax dollars than it consumes (to my knowledge). So that's a stupid question. But what if populations shift again? We need to take care of our forests. Our plains. The watershed that allows us to feed ourselves, and if allowed to be ruined (it's being ruined) will hurt our nation in centuries, millennia to come. (Que being dramatic, but I am being serious about this, if using hyperbole).

I'm sorry I'm shitting in your thread.




um. I believe the electoral college was 1) put in place to try and balance the powers of different parts of the country, 2) often goes with popular vote anyway, 3) while imperfect, I believe many of the actual problems are with our 2 party system or our very vastly sprawled (and changing) population. 4) If we could just *make it happen* I guess I could be okay with it (I'd like to do more thinking and reading on it. I like to be sure of things I decide), but I think there are more important issues first (not that you didn't list many things, many that I do like, (I even kinda like the first one), but putting the electoral college as your #1 was off putting to me.

Sorry for more shitty.




tl;dr
What do you think you know better than our Forefathers? Why don't you start your own country you redcoat.

 

1) The founding fathers were not perfect: 3/5's a black man/slavery, the original election process (loser of presidential election or #2 in votes became VP), every amendment after the 10th, ect. I could go on all day. The point is they felt that the Constitution should be an organic guideline not be taken completely literal and to be changed when felt necessary. 

 

2) The Electoral College is flawed and incredibly outdated: The electoral college is governed by each individual state law and frankly can be undermined by any "official" who chooses not to vote correctly. Why would you continue to maintain a broken system when you can make it better? A popular vote would also encourage higher turnout in states that where the vote has previously been predetermined by overwhelming majority. Nothing would change on the state's level for state officials, which is done by popular vote anyway. 



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#11 KiWi

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Posted 28 October 2014 - 10:49 PM



um. I believe the electoral college was 1) put in place to try and balance the powers of different parts of the country, 2) often goes with popular vote anyway, 3) while imperfect, I believe many of the actual problems are with our 2 party system or our very vastly sprawled (and changing) population. 4) If we could just *make it happen* I guess I could be okay with it (I'd like to do more thinking and reading on it. I like to be sure of things I decide), but I think there are more important issues first (not that you didn't list many things, many that I do like, (I even kinda like the first one), but putting the electoral college as your #1 was off putting to me.

 
1) The founding fathers were not perfect: 3/5's a black man/slavery, the original election process (loser of presidential election or #2 in votes became VP), every amendment after the 10th, ect. I could go on all day. The point is they felt that the Constitution should be an organic guideline not be taken completely literal and to be changed when felt necessary. 
 
2) The Electoral College is flawed and incredibly outdated: The electoral college is governed by each individual state law and frankly can be undermined by any "official" who chooses not to vote correctly. Why would you continue to maintain a broken system when you can make it better? A popular vote would also encourage higher turnout in states that where the vote has previously been predetermined by overwhelming majority. Nothing would change on the state's level for state officials, which is done by popular vote anyway. 
 



1) Point conceded. But they had a reason for doing it. I would like to examine the system in depth before just making changes.

2) I agree. Your points about the state law and the Faithless elector problem are noted, and I would like to fix those problems as well. Is the solution to just go straight to a purely popular vote though?

And while I agree that the idea that your vote for a republican, for example in Maryland is a "wasted vote" and can discourage voters; we have no idea what effect the change would have and I believe such feelings that repress voter turnout have more to do with our dissatisfaction with our government/two party system in general.

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#12 Justavictim82

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Posted 28 October 2014 - 11:44 PM





um. I believe the electoral college was 1) put in place to try and balance the powers of different parts of the country, 2) often goes with popular vote anyway, 3) while imperfect, I believe many of the actual problems are with our 2 party system or our very vastly sprawled (and changing) population. 4) If we could just *make it happen* I guess I could be okay with it (I'd like to do more thinking and reading on it. I like to be sure of things I decide), but I think there are more important issues first (not that you didn't list many things, many that I do like, (I even kinda like the first one), but putting the electoral college as your #1 was off putting to me.


1) The founding fathers were not perfect: 3/5's a black man/slavery, the original election process (loser of presidential election or #2 in votes became VP), every amendment after the 10th, ect. I could go on all day. The point is they felt that the Constitution should be an organic guideline not be taken completely literal and to be changed when felt necessary.

2) The Electoral College is flawed and incredibly outdated: The electoral college is governed by each individual state law and frankly can be undermined by any "official" who chooses not to vote correctly. Why would you continue to maintain a broken system when you can make it better? A popular vote would also encourage higher turnout in states that where the vote has previously been predetermined by overwhelming majority. Nothing would change on the state's level for state officials, which is done by popular vote anyway.



1) Point conceded. But they had a reason for doing it. I would like to examine the system in depth before just making changes.

2) I agree. Your points about the state law and the Faithless elector problem are noted, and I would like to fix those problems as well. Is the solution to just go straight to a purely popular vote though?

And while I agree that the idea that your vote for a republican, for example in Maryland is a "wasted vote" and can discourage voters; we have no idea what effect the change would have and I believe such feelings that repress voter turnout have more to do with our dissatisfaction with our government/two party system in general.

The overall turnout for the 2012 Presidental Election was awful. The percentage of people voting are near all time lows. Anything we can do to encourage voting ahoukd be on the table.

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#13 ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

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Posted 29 October 2014 - 12:01 PM

The Electoral College should be abolished. It is an 18th century anachronism that has no place in the modern world. Voting should be compulsory. If you don't vote you get a nekkid visit from Nas.



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#14 Phate

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Posted 29 October 2014 - 12:11 PM

The Electoral College should be abolished. It is an 18th century anachronism that has no place in the modern world. Voting should be compulsory. If you don't vote you get a nekkid visit from Nas.

 

Agreed, Australia has it right. Compulsory voting and a small ($25ish) fine for not voting. It encourages voting, but is reasonable if you don't.



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#15 ᗅᗺᗷᗅ

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Posted 29 October 2014 - 12:21 PM

There should also be a three-day weekend for voting. A national holiday, so everyone has a chance to get there.

 

I'm also on board with photo IDs for voting. It's 2014 — we require photo IDs to do any number of things far more trivial than voting. But there's a caveat: I think the government should provide them to every citizen free of charge.



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#16 Redezra

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Posted 29 October 2014 - 06:21 PM

The Electoral College should be abolished. It is an 18th century anachronism that has no place in the modern world. Voting should be compulsory. If you don't vote you get a nekkid visit from Nas.

 

Agreed, Australia has it right. Compulsory voting and a small ($25ish) fine for not voting. It encourages voting, but is reasonable if you don't.

 

Aww yeah, Australia for best governing system.

 

Oh wait, no, it's fucking retarded. I'm not sure where I stand anymore.

 

 

 

Also, we're all for voting by drawing penises on the voting forms. Lots of people do that. That's a vote to "Fuck all you lot".



#17 KiWi

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Posted 29 October 2014 - 08:17 PM

I just don't know how to respond anymore.

Do we need a separate compulsory voting thread?

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#18 Manoka

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Posted 29 October 2014 - 11:28 PM

There should also be a three-day weekend for voting. A national holiday, so everyone has a chance to get there.

 

I'm also on board with photo IDs for voting. It's 2014 — we require photo IDs to do any number of things far more trivial than voting. But there's a caveat: I think the government should provide them to every citizen free of charge.

But if they have to go and wait in line and get a picture taken it's where the real trouble comes in. O_O



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#19 Justavictim82

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Posted 30 October 2014 - 12:56 AM

Added to OP with bolded content. I will remove and place in categories older content and continue to add new content with bold or italics as I wish. 



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